If one year's back on my shoulder
Not having read any of the source novels, approximately twenty minutes into the first series of Poldark (1975–77) as I lay on the couch self-medicating with the late eighteenth century, I remarked to ![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png)
spatch, "Is there any aspect of this homecoming that is not going to be a clusterfuck?" on which the answer turned out to be no, whence it seems the engine of the plot. Since I came to this show by having to wait for the third season of Turn: Washington's Spies (2014–17) to arrive at my local branch library, I was more than ordinarily entertained by the line pertaining to the hero's soldiering past, "Shocking business, eh? Losing the Colonies." The bomber leather frock coat is as impressive as advertised.
spatch, "Is there any aspect of this homecoming that is not going to be a clusterfuck?" on which the answer turned out to be no, whence it seems the engine of the plot. Since I came to this show by having to wait for the third season of Turn: Washington's Spies (2014–17) to arrive at my local branch library, I was more than ordinarily entertained by the line pertaining to the hero's soldiering past, "Shocking business, eh? Losing the Colonies." The bomber leather frock coat is as impressive as advertised.
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It's fair to say that there's nothing involving a Poldark or a Warleggan that is not a clusterfuck. XD
In general, the 70s edition is my favourite (over books & 2015 version), as you will have noticed, but impressively in the books (and the 2015) the homecoming is even worse, because Ross walks right into the engagement party for Francis and Elizabeth, going, hi, not dead after all, everyone! (I understand why the 70s changed it, because they use that to do some key groundwork for the Ross & Elizabeth storyline, but the sheer drama of original canon there is faultless.)
Also, generally: *flails* I mean, obv, I hope Turn comes in for you, but while it's wending its way you-wards, I hope you enjoy your visit to the other side of the Atlantic.
And you'll have seen enough to understand now why I, having seen Robin Ellis first as Essex in Elizabeth R and then as Ross & also as Franklin Blake in The Moonstone, on spotting he was in the 1971 Sense & Sensibility just went, oh, well, yes, who else would be Willoughby? And then he walked in as Edward Ferrars & while I was still recovering from that, Clive Francis turned up as Willoughby, because sometimes watching non-linearly is the funniest way to do things. XD
(Funnily enough, while you've been watching this, I've been watching a 2019 film that had Clive Francis doing a cameo in the middle. I wasn't sure if he was still alive/still working to that date, but he still had that unmistakable weirdly off-beat charm of his, so it had to be him).
... I don't know why I say 'funnily' at this point, really. I should just say 'inevitably', given that we apparently do only have about 20 actors, so while you were watching Turn, inevitably I was watching Kevin McNally in a 2025 crime drama, and when you turned to Poldark, I watched a thing with 21st C Clive Francis. Oh, all while listening to a 1980s radio drama with Robin Ellis.
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I do appreciate that at the same time as he poses romantically on the elemental sea-cliffs of Cornwall, Ross Poldark also wakes up on the world's least comfortable-looking settle after a night at the tables because stairs were too complicated when he came home.
In general, the 70s edition is my favourite (over books & 2015 version), as you will have noticed, but impressively in the books (and the 2015) the homecoming is even worse, because Ross walks right into the engagement party for Francis and Elizabeth, going, hi, not dead after all, everyone! (I understand why the 70s changed it, because they use that to do some key groundwork for the Ross & Elizabeth storyline, but the sheer drama of original canon there is faultless.)
It's the single most dramatic move he could have unintentionally made, which already feels on brand.
What do you prefer about the '70's adaptation to the books? Which I realize is a broad question, so I am probably asking for something like choices in the writing or acting or the handling of the material overall?
Also, generally: *flails* I mean, obv, I hope Turn comes in for you
If I time it right, I can give myself Kevin McNally future shock!
but while it's wending its way you-wards, I hope you enjoy your visit to the other side of the Atlantic.
Thank you! So far, so good! The internet totally lied about its availability on streaming services to which I have access, so I am watching copies on the Internet Archive that may literally have come off someone's VHS. It's definitely making me feel I need more interesting waistcoats.
And you'll have seen enough to understand now why I, having seen Robin Ellis first as Essex in Elizabeth R and then as Ross & also as Franklin Blake in The Moonstone, on spotting he was in the 1971 Sense & Sensibility just went, oh, well, yes, who else would be Willoughby? And then he walked in as Edward Ferrars & while I was still recovering from that, Clive Francis turned up as Willoughby, because sometimes watching non-linearly is the funniest way to do things.
Absolutely. Matched only by discovering an actor when cast against type, i.e. I wondered a night or so ago what Burn Gorman had been doing with himself and the answer turned out to be "playing the weirdo of a central quartet of villains in a potentially supernatural crime thriller, what was I thinking?"
(Funnily enough, while you've been watching this, I've been watching a 2019 film that had Clive Francis doing a cameo in the middle. I wasn't sure if he was still alive/still working to that date, but he still had that unmistakable weirdly off-beat charm of his, so it had to be him).
Nice! I can see that he was doing Bridgerton as late as last year, kudos for returning to one of his native eras. I agree with your assessment of his charm, since my affection for the actor is not explained by most of the roles in which I have seen him—case in point, the first having been the sleek solicitor-murdererer of the 1987 BBC Strong Poison.
[edit] A complication! Due to the intermittent nature of my interactions with media, my mother believes I could have seen him guest-starring in an episode of Granada Holmes before she showed me the BBC Harriet Vane mysteries, which since it was "The Man with the Twisted Lip" (1986) could definitely have imbued me with liking for a character as well as the caliber of his performance.
... I don't know why I say 'funnily' at this point, really. I should just say 'inevitably', given that we apparently do only have about 20 actors, so while you were watching Turn, inevitably I was watching Kevin McNally in a 2025 crime drama, and when you turned to Poldark, I watched a thing with 21st C Clive Francis. Oh, all while listening to a 1980s radio drama with Robin Ellis.
I am delighted by the shape of this cinematic universe. I don't think one can expect character actors or they shy off into the undergrowth, but otherwise they will reliably, unpredictably just appear.
(Which radio drama? I rewatched She Loves Me again after linking it for
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I do like some of their changes - they definitely handle at least one of the most difficult storylines by far the best out of the three - and the very 1970s choices either suit me very well (like Demelza's extra fierceness and Angharad's delight in playing it, even if Winston Graham was less pleased, since he based her on his wife) or amuse me, like Verity being all "I used to be shy but I got over it," and them burning down buildings that should not be burnt.
Overall, though, a lot is just about how I encountered them, really - I was ill as a teenager too, so stuck home and I wound up reading a lot of my Mum's books, with varying results. She really loved Poldark so I didn't want to like it, but I read all 7 books of the first sequence because actually they were quite good but I was extremely grudging about it, refused to like Ross and Demelza, did not like the (highly unflattering) pics of Robin Ellis and Angharad on the covers at all, but I loved Dwight and Caroline so much, and later Morwenna and Drake.
I finally watched the series about 11 or 12 years ago now and it turns out those publicity shots were totally misleading and Robin Ellis and Angharad Rees were amazing, and I was older and better able to understand the other storylines. I have reread some of the books since & could appreciate them better, but since I still struggle with reading, the TV show is my favourite. But, as I said, I love the cast, and I like that even when it departs from its source material, it demonstrates that it gets it at every turn and somtimes improves on it.
They are interesting books, though, and I thought a new version could be pretty good, even if I resented its timing (I'd only just come to love the first one!), but either the BBC or the adaptor went for Sunday night candyfloss. Which could have been fine, except they also didn't change it enough, so it ended up as eye candy with mere lip service to the social issues but also kept the jailbreaks, murder, death, war, smuggling, copper mining, the (one central) rape, and abuse intact regardless. S1 isn't bad, though, and it had a strong cast, but it felt at times like the adaptor didn't know what was coming later.
If I time it right, I can give myself Kevin McNally future shock!
LOL!
and the answer turned out to be "playing the weirdo of a central quartet of villains in a potentially supernatural crime thriller, what was I thinking?"
But of course he has! XD
I agree with your assessment of his charm, since my affection for the actor is not explained by most of the roles in which I have seen him—case in point, the first having been the sleek solicitor-murdererer of the 1987 BBC Strong Poison.
I do like him as Francis here, and I've seen him in other things (amusingly, in the 70s, mainly only with fellow Poldark alumni - with RE in S&S, marrying Angharad Rees in As You Like It & being Norma Streader's brother-in-law in an episode of Enemy at the Door). I'm glad, whether or not he had earlier reason to engage your affections or not, that you get what I mean! Whatever it is, it seems to work for him.
(Which radio drama? I rewatched She Loves Me again after linking it
Ha, I had to watch bits of your linked Poldark! It was an adaptation of Wilkie Collins's No Name (1989), with Sophie Thompson as Magdalen. He's not in it that much, but I'm on the final episode where he comes to the fore now. I found it after looking Robin Ellis's radio credits up on Genome as he seems to have done a fair bit of it & hunted it down on YT.
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My condolences to the author who is literally dead, I was thrilled by Demelza turning up as full-bore feral as she does. Her introduction made me inclined to bet that Patricia C. Wrede had seen this series. My mother has seen this series. I mentioned that we'd started it and she immediately began to describe Robin Ellis.
or amuse me, like Verity being all "I used to be shy but I got over it," and them burning down buildings that should not be burnt.
Haven't gotten there yet, am delighted to hear it, I like Verity immensely. So far she often seems to be the person in the room with the brain cell.
the (highly unflattering) pics of Robin Ellis and Angharad
That was very impressive of the photographer, considering the material to work with.
and I like that even when it departs from its source material, it demonstrates that it gets it at every turn and somtimes improves on it.
That is about the most important qualification for an adaptation, so, good!
But of course he has!
And if it ever turns up in this country, I'll watch it!
I do like him as Francis here
Francis is a trash fire, it should go without saying that I like him.
(amusingly, in the 70s, mainly only with fellow Poldark alumni - with RE in S&S, marrying Angharad Rees in As You Like It & being Norma Streader's brother-in-law in an episode of Enemy at the Door)
Hah! Why waste good chemistry, I guess? He also makes those couple of appearances as Caroline Blakiston's Russian opposite number in Mr. Palfrey. You should do him as an Element sometime.
Ha, I had to watch bits of your linked Poldark!
Oh, good, feedback loop!
I found it after looking Robin Ellis's radio credits up on Genome as he seems to have done a fair bit of it & hunted it down on YT.
Nice! I'm glad you have his radio work to branch into.
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Aw, good. I mean, I think she's quite feral at the start in the books, too; she just calms down sooner and rather more than the 70s one ever entirely does & I am 110% Team Angharad on that one. And, heh, re. your mother! Glad to know Ross was so memorable. XD
I like Verity immensely. So far she often seems to be the person in the room with the brain cell.
Yeah, she is the one possible exception to the non-clusterfuck Poldark rule, but then again, she also makes Choices, lol. I do like Norma Streader generally, too. I forget what else I've come across her in aside from EatD and Poldark, but I'm sure there was something, and she's always good.
Francis is a trash fire, it should go without saying that I like him.
Also aww and yay. (George is an even bigger trash fire, but unless you're going very speedily, I don't think you will have achieved Ralph Bates yet, or at least not more than a glimpse of him).
Actually, one funny thing about you giving that link is that I had never realised there were 16 episodes in s1! I'd just assumed there were 13 as usual for UK 70s TV. My DVD copy is unfortunately one of the BBC Playback ones they did of a few things taken from the VHS editions where they edited three or four episodes into one long episide. (Only the intro/credits are missing, though, but it does mean that I have to guess where each episode starts and ends. Now I realise I have three whole more episodes than I may have been accounting for!)
You should do him as an Element sometime.
He would be a rather good one! I wonder which... ?
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That's neat. I assume it made good use of the extra time.
He would be a rather good one! I wonder which... ?
I was going to complain about how difficult it is to think of an unexpectedly charming element, but then I thought of how much I like tungsten filaments over LEDs. It has a variety of weird properties, alloys well, and its source ores are often found when mining tin.
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Ha. <3 It also has some fabulous coats! Ross's bomber jacket and red velvet have already been noted, but Francis has a beautiful embroidered blue one later, and George Warleggan gets an memorably striped one.
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I'm not knocking the coats! I just feel my chances of improving my waistcoat game are realistically better than my eighteenth-century coat prospects, sadly.
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(a) Allowing for my incomplete knowledge of beige TV Clive Francis, he had a visible through-line of attractive trash fires in this period that would make sense of that casting. I don't know that I would have caught it without Middlemarch, but Fred Vincy is the mayor's charming failson who racks up such debts living on his expectations that his shock disinheritance leaves him more than financially embarrassed, unable to repay the father of the girl he loves for backing one of his irresponsibly accrued bills and far from a sure bet to get his act together and make good no matter how sincerely he means to. (Of the one episode of the 1968 BBC version available on YouTube—telerecorded, glitchy, what else is new—his major scenes involve accepting a bailout he feels weird about, failing to advance his suit with his love interest, and quarreling with his sister about her choice of beau, all of which is accurate to the book but still very funny to me.) Willoughby leaves much more damage in the wake of his charm, but the 1971 Sense and Sensibility seems unusually sympathetic toward him in his last interview with Elinor where his strength of feeling for Marianne comes through as clearly as his painful awareness that he might have hurt her less with a calculated seduction than he did with real affection that flanicked itself into a fortune-hunting marriage, to the point that Elinor agrees to transmit his sentiments to her sister outright as opposed to the much more guarded response she gives him in the book. I have seen the actor as an out-and-out villain, so I know he had that skill set, but his real gift looks like fuck-ups who are yet not total write-offs.
(b) I am profoundly entertained that this same version of Sense and Sensibility provides an Edward Ferrars surprised at home en déshabillé, thus proving that a serial in possession of a hot leading man must be in want of a scene that shows it off even if most of his appeal to that point has been his adorkability. The 1999 The Winslow Boy owes obvious royalties.
(c) And their John Dashwood was played by Milton Johns, last seen cheating Francis at cards, the Poldark cinematic universe really is microscopic.
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Oh, yes. I mean, my second reaction to that casting, after I stopped laughing, was that I knew from Poldark he ought to be great at the confession scene - and he was!
And, aww, you even watched S&S! <3 I love it, but it does have a shaky start even in addition to one of those baffling 70s things where any sort of visible weight in an actor apparently lends decades to their age. (Patricia Routledge here is the third time I've come across this weirdity as a thing. She's a great Mrs Jennings here, but it is at least 20 years too early!) Joanna David is such a lovely choice for Elinor, too. I enjoyed both the 1980 and the 1971 in different ways, although I wasn't really happy with either of their Colonel Brandons - tho' I watched them too close together to remember which was which, because I do feel like I liked one more than the other. (I think the 1980 one but don't quote me).
Of the one episode of the 1968 BBC version available on YouTube—telerecorded, glitchy, what else is new—his major scenes involve accepting a bailout he feels weird about, failing to advance his suit with his love interest, and quarreling with his sister about her choice of beau, all of which is accurate to the book but still very funny to me.
Ha, but of course!
It is like the way every single thing about David Collings makes so much more sense when you realise he started out with playing Raskolnikov and then just murdered, angsted, broke down, died, and wept on for at least a decade and a half, with interruptions for being non-human.
I am profoundly entertained that this same version of Sense and Sensibility provides an Edward Ferrars surprised at home en déshabillé,
XD Me, too. They were determined to have a sexy Edward! It's very funny that even Andrew Davies wasn't up to this kind of thing, not with these two anyway.
And their John Dashwood was played by Milton Johns, last seen cheating Francis at cards, the Poldark cinematic universe really is microscopic.
Oh, I'd forgotten! Milton Johns weasels in everywhere, really, so I don't count him on the tally, but of course he is. (He used to turn up to ruin all the children's telly while I was young and always be simultaneously weirdly likeable while he did it, although he will forever be iconic for doing his level best to sell the DW villain who somehow hasn't noticed he still has a working eye under his eyepatch. Sometimes actors really earn their pay. XD)
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He was! And when you phrase it like that accounts for what he's doing in As You Like It. It is definitely what he's doing in his episode of The Return of Sherlock Holmes. That entire script builds to Clive Francis explaining himself and it's great.
liadt was very kind and made a dvd of it off YT, because the actual DVD release is not really obtainable any more & obv I loved it with that cast anyway.
I am very glad you have that. I just watched it off YouTube. I may have been ruined for Colonel Brandons by Alan Rickman, but otherwise I enjoyed it very much! The practicality of the proposal scene reminded me favorably of a similar touch in Stand-In (1937), against stiff competition possibly Leslie Howard's geekiest film and consequently dear to me.
Ha, but of course!
I hadn't even finished Francis' plotline when I read Middlemarch and he made so much sense as Fred, it was rough. If he had an ingenue period, it must have lasted about ten seconds. The BBC is supposed to have six out of seven episodes in their archives and given the state of some of their other long-sought releases, I don't see the impediment.
It is like the way every single thing about David Collings makes so much more sense when you realise he started out with playing Raskolnikov and then just murdered, angsted, broke down, died, and wept on for at least a decade and a half, with interruptions for being non-human.
He seemed a lot healthier when he wasn't human!
although he will forever be iconic for doing his level best to sell the DW villain who somehow hasn't noticed he still has a working eye under his eyepatch. Sometimes actors really earn their pay.
I can respect that. (Better or worse than having to be a space moth?)
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Oh, nice. I mean, my main reason for wishing for a dvd was to gif the proposal scene, which I immediately did.
I can respect that. (Better or worse than having to be a space moth?)
Well, nobody can see you when you're a prince of the space moths, but OTOH there are bulky costumes, choreography and strange voices to navigate, sometimes while being chased by giant space ants who can't see where they're going. But still, having to look yourself in the mirror and discover that you'd been wrong for (years? I'm sure it's years) about what was under your eyepatch really does beg some questions nothing in the script has any answers for, and it's supposed to be a big emotional moment of betrayal for the character. XD
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You can't say that and not link me the gif!
But still, having to look yourself in the mirror and discover that you'd been wrong for (years? I'm sure it's years) about what was under your eyepatch really does beg some questions nothing in the script has any answers for, and it's supposed to be a big emotional moment of betrayal for the character.
I thought you were just referring to the dodginess of the costume. That deserved hazard pay!
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Sorry, it's here. I was so convinced I'd made a post and linked to it and you'd already seen it! It turns out that I don't seem to have done, only a little review & link to the YT edition when I watched it. (Or if I did link to the tumblr post, God knows what I tagged it with, because it wasn't any of the tags I ought to have used).
I thought you were just referring to the dodginess of the costume. That deserved hazard pay!
No, he's just a regular human! Who never washes under his eyepatch or takes it off to sleep, apparently. XD
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Thank you! I agree with you that the scene could have used some kissing and otherwise it is lovely.
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