sovay: (PJ Harvey: crow)
sovay ([personal profile] sovay) wrote2025-01-17 03:50 pm

Maybe you're happy, but I hope you're sad

I understand the entire point of this profile of 1980's Bennington is the writers who came out of it and that she herself went to the Catholic University of America, but by the end it really sounds like a Liz Hand novel.

After establishing that Norman Lindsay's Man and leopard-woman in a room (1900s–10s) which I first saw elsenet without sourcing was not the product of extractive AI, I particularly admire the naturally occurring gloves on the leopard-woman and I expect the next drawing in the sequence to have shown his dressing gown in shreds and no leopard-woman to be seen.

I am not any more pleased with this month after hearing that Joan Plowright just died.
naraht: Moonrise over Earth (Default)

[personal profile] naraht 2025-01-17 10:20 pm (UTC)(link)
I understand the entire point of this profile of 1980's Bennington is the writers who came out of it and that she herself went to the Catholic University of America, but by the end it really sounds like a Liz Hand novel.

By Lili Anolik. Because of course it is.
naraht: Moonrise over Earth (Default)

[personal profile] naraht 2025-01-17 10:54 pm (UTC)(link)
She wrote a book all about being obsessed with Eve Babitz, and then another book about Eve Babitz AND Joan Didion, and granted she came to my attention because I got into both Babitz and Didion for the first time last year, but her particular brand of obsessed-with-star-author is (IMO) just on the verge of cringey, and it kinda leaves me unsurprised she's also into Donna Tartt.

On reflection I have no idea if my reaction and yours are at all congruent, as I've never read a Liz Hand novel.
gwynnega: (Basil Rathbone)

[personal profile] gwynnega 2025-01-18 12:08 am (UTC)(link)
I didn't make it all the way through that Bennington profile, but yeah. (I'm currently reading Lili Anolik's book on Didion and Babitz.) The piece made me glad I opted to go to UCLA and live at home! I was terribly jealous of Bret Easton Ellis when Less Than Zero came out, because he's my age and also from the Valley, and I'd written a novel about me, my private school friends and rock'n'roll musician friends, but I couldn't get it published (though I had interest from a publisher at one point). Also, I went to school with Quintana Dunne (and we both went on a school trip to Greece in 1979)!
gwynnega: (Leslie Howard mswyrr)

[personal profile] gwynnega 2025-01-18 05:12 am (UTC)(link)
We went to Athens, Crete, and several other places. Somewhere I have the journal I kept of the trip, though the last time I looked at it, I discovered I'd spent a lot more pages complaining about the other girls than detailing the sights! Mainly I remember that we seemed to eat a different variation of baklava every day, and that I bought a terrific punk rock compilation LP that I managed to lug home with me.
selkie: (Default)

[personal profile] selkie 2025-01-18 12:20 am (UTC)(link)
Wylding Hall always felt like something that could easily have stumbled upon younger, more-beautiful us, and the article was very Wylding Hall .
theseatheseatheopensea: Lyrics from the song Stolen property, by The Triffids, handwritten by David McComb. (Default)

[personal profile] theseatheseatheopensea 2025-01-18 04:05 am (UTC)(link)
After establishing that Norman Lindsay's Man and leopard-woman in a room (1900s–10s) which I first saw elsenet without sourcing was not the product of extractive AI, I particularly admire the naturally occurring gloves on the leopard-woman and I expect the next drawing in the sequence to have shown his dressing gown in shreds and no leopard-woman to be seen.

This is amazing--it could be one of those delightful five minute art fandoms next Yuletide!
rachelmanija: (Books: old)

[personal profile] rachelmanija 2025-01-18 04:20 am (UTC)(link)
I understand the entire point of this profile of 1980's Bennington is the writers who came out of it and that she herself went to the Catholic University of America, but by the end it really sounds like a Liz Hand novel.

It TOTALLY does.
nineweaving: (Default)

[personal profile] nineweaving 2025-01-18 04:22 am (UTC)(link)
... by the end it really sounds like a Liz Hand novel.

It's smugger than Liz Hand. Only one of them would have made it to graduation, with terrible and beautiful psychic wounds.

I particularly admire the naturally occurring gloves on the leopard-woman and I expect the next drawing in the sequence to have shown his dressing gown in shreds and no leopard-woman to be seen.

Mraow.

I am not any more pleased with this month after hearing that Joan Plowright just died.

Damn.

I want to have Orson Welles's Moby-Dick, with Plowright as Pip.

Nine



selkie: (Default)

[personal profile] selkie 2025-01-18 05:09 am (UTC)(link)
Well, the ones interviewed are the ones who made it out alive.

Oh, I would not have -- I would have listened to the wrong voice in the autumn woods -- but I'd have had a wild, full-throated time [Edit: I came back to say this does not only mean Selkie, you slut, stop biting randos ] until my scholarship ran out, and you'd have a little clothbound book of my scintillating short stories in your office safe, in the many-windowed office from which you ran a cabal and looked dapper doing it. Blood sacrifice would likely be involved, but whatever. I'd do my level best to pop up out of tropical seas where your yacht was.
Edited 2025-01-18 05:13 (UTC)
selkie: (Default)

[personal profile] selkie 2025-01-18 05:11 am (UTC)(link)
Ellen Datlow or the other one [edit: it was Delia!] called you a genius today and so did Liz Williams! Hi!
nineweaving: (Default)

[personal profile] nineweaving 2025-01-19 05:29 am (UTC)(link)
Wait, what? Is this referring to [personal profile] sovay (which makes perfect sense) or to me (which is puzzling).

Nine
selkie: (Default)

[personal profile] selkie 2025-01-19 05:34 am (UTC)(link)
It was referring to you, and it's not at allpuzzling if you ask me, and it was in a Facebook commentary thread on Delia's favorite writers, and if I have brains in the morning I'll get a screenshot. (I mean, S is also a genius of considerable style, but didn't come up in the post.)
nineweaving: (Default)

[personal profile] nineweaving 2025-01-22 08:47 pm (UTC)(link)
Gosh. When I see "genius," I think S.

Thanks for passing this on.

Nine

alexxkay: (Default)

[personal profile] alexxkay 2025-01-18 06:20 am (UTC)(link)
Hrm. I wonder if there's any connection between that piece and Caress of the Sphinx, from a decade or so earlier?

[I know that painting because it features prominently in Greg Egan's short story "The Caress".]
oracne: turtle (Default)

[personal profile] oracne 2025-01-18 10:35 pm (UTC)(link)
RIP Joan Plowright.
rushthatspeaks: (sparklepony only wants to read)

[personal profile] rushthatspeaks 2025-01-20 02:40 am (UTC)(link)
I'm glad the article sounds like a Liz Hand story, but I cannot trust Lili Anolik on anything after having encountered her readings of Eve Babitz, which are simply unforgivable. I understand the urge to compare Babitz to Didion, the major two female writers about L. A. in that specific time, but the thing is that Didion is part and parcel of American Literature The Establishment, sort of person who published in the New Yorker, and Babitz is something far wilder and stranger.

I think of Didion when I think of, like, oh fuck, this referent has changed meaning since I would last have used it, but Alice Munroe before we knew the truth, that specific public image. The writers I compare Babitz to are Le Guin, Francesca Lia Block, and Colette.

I gave your mother Eve Babitz for Christmas this year. I would never voluntarily purchase Didion for anybody.

If I had not been reading a library copy of the Anolik book on Babitz and Didion, it might have lost a couple of pages from sheer wrath.

So I'm glad she can paint a picture, but I wouldn't swear it has any relation to anything a reasonable person would accept as fact.
rushthatspeaks: (sparklepony only wants to read)

[personal profile] rushthatspeaks 2025-01-20 11:11 pm (UTC)(link)
So Didion has a problem which in some ways I don't blame her for and in other ways I do, a thing that a lot of female artists have fallen into over centuries: she feels that on some level she is not complete without a man. Not that he needs to be a great artist himself, a common further trap within the trap, but that being married, specifically to a man, was necessary as the center of her psychological life. And Didion's best work, from everything I can tell, is centered around her nuclear family and the griefwork around the death of her daughter, which is neutral as a fact by itself, except that I think there is a level on which she could not permit herself to do that sort of work about anything other than, specifically, her nuclear family, approved and permitted by the society around her.

What I am saying here is that, on a personal level, Joan Didion is essentially a conformist. Not that there's necessarily anything wrong with that, though it makes her less congenial to me personally.

Lili Anolik somehow manages to miss that Eve Babitz wasn't.

Men, individually or multiple-- the concept of family at all-- were not necessary to Eve Babitz' self-conception, or to her concept of herself as an artist. When she decided during her college-age years that what she was going to do with her life was become an adventuress, she meant like Madame du Barry or Moll Cutpurse or Aphra Behn: there were men, there were lots of different men, there were even important men who were perceived as being her patrons or the causes of her fame and notoriety, but none of them were central to her life, even if they were brilliant artists in their own right. Babitz never for one second considered, or would have considered, marrying any of them in any sense that would mean real partnership, which in her time period meant that she never married, since she did not have to to accomplish her ambitions or survive. She never mentions wanting children, and I don't think she ever did, but if she didn't and became pregnant she would have aborted without compunction, and if she had wanted kids she would have borne them as a single parent. Those decisions were hers and hers alone, as was everything else about the way she lived, the sex she had or didn't, and the art she made. And she would not have considered there to be a moral element about these choices. Didion, I suspect, finds it virtuous to have married. Babitz would laugh at that concept, and/or be sickened by it, and she would have had to have someone explain it to her, because it would not be something she'd figure out by herself that anybody could really believe.

And I don't know how this is possible, except that I've seen it, but Anolik just misses entirely that Eve Babitz was not psychologically dependent on any conception of men. She consistently mistakes the Cat Who Walks By Herself for Anaïs Nin, and you know how I feel about Anaïs fucking Nin. And every time Anolik does it I want to throw something and scream and tear out the page, leaving very few pages left sticking to the binding. Anolik, as far as I can tell, just still lives in a world in which the artistic and emotional lives of all women are centered around men in some way, and simply does not get that this is not how Babitz works, when it is one of the most refreshing and endearing things about Eve Babitz. Babitz shares with Louise Brooks the quality of just completely breezing past massive quantities of bullshit that just about everyone both among her contemporaries and even since falls into, and also with Louise Brooks the quality that some people physically cannot see what they are looking at.

Babitz is a touch more cynical than Brooks, but Babitz was a romantic, so maybe the confusion is somewhat more understandable. The thing is, though, when I say Romantic, I mean the capital letter, because Babitz' love affairs were meant to be dramatic and massive and sublime and sturm und drang and riding off on a white horse with a gallant guerilla leader to succor the losing side in the Spanish Civil War (she was upset about being too young to do this), and also ending without changing or affecting anything about her essential personality one iota. And always ending.

Babitz read Colette as a teenager, and took her as very good advice, which is only the plain truth.

It may have literally happened, but I can't imagine Joan Didion reading Colette.

If Anolik has read Colette, she didn't learn a damn thing from it.