I'm lucid, but I still can't think

[sovay]

Good news! According to the ENT this afternoon, I do not have a sinus infection. I have the aftermath of two months of sinus infection and therefore get to put steroids up my nose until it gets better. We live in a wonderful world.

1. I had never heard of Jinwar, the Yazidi women's commune and I strongly feel I should have. Especially since "Jinwar grew out of the democratic ideology that has fuelled the creation of Rojava, a Kurdish-run statelet in north-eastern Syria, since the civil war broke out in 2011 . . . The women's revolution, as it is known, is a significant part of Rojava's philosophy. Angered by the atrocities committed by Isis, Kurdish women formed their own fighting units. Later, Arab and Yazidi recruits joined them on the front lines to liberate their sisters." I should have heard about that.

2. I'm mostly boosting this article about Mesopotamian stargazing because I studied with the professor quoted within. He was one of the best parts of my time at Yale.

3. Discussing the fading of the Ruritanian romance as a popular genre with moon_custafer a few months back, I said that I thought its scarcity in the second half of the twentieth century had more to do with the fact that the landscape of Europe shifted so comprehensively that any further entries would have to be period pieces—after 1945, Europe was simply no longer covered with plausible small monarchies into which English or American strangers could wander and be caught up in swashbuckling intrigue. The essential conceit of creating fictitious, generally Central European countries never died out, but I think the majority of it was diverted into secondary-world fantasy or into more realist modes like Jan Morris' Hav or Ursula K. Le Guin's Orsinia or even Wes Anderson's The Grand Budapest Hotel (2014), which is explicitly a romance until it runs into history. Does this hypothesis actually match other people's experience? Is there an entire school of contemporary Ruritanian romance that I've just missed? Are they just mostly post-Soviet states these days?

It's snowing outside, quietly dusting down into the street. Earlier this evening I watched Johnny Eager (1942) because it was on TCM and I will never cease to love that movie; I ate some goat's milk custard for dessert and kindly did not take pictures of Autolycus while he had his head stuck in the plastic container. I have hopes of actually sleeping tonight.

Comments

[alexxkay]

Not sure if it counts as *romance*, but I've always thought of Doctor Doom's homeland of Latveria as Ruritanian. Mainstream superhero comics had regular appearances by odd little countries in Eastern Europe or the Middle East at least into the early 2000s (when I largely stopped following them).

[sovay]

Not sure if it counts as *romance*, but I've always thought of Doctor Doom's homeland of Latveria as Ruritanian.

It's romance in the sense of high adventure rather than romance in the sense of smooching: I'm willing to entertain superhero narratives under that umbrella.

Okay, so: does Black Panther (2018) count as a Ruritanian romance? It's got high adventure and intrigue, outsiders in a fictional country, and even, eventually, the restoration of the throne.

[moon_custafer]

I was thinking over the topic this morning, and I’d say Latveria definitely counts as Ruritanian, but that it has a built-in answer to “how does a small Central-European monarchy still exist, post-WWII?” with “this particular one is ruled by a super-genius inventor— your move.”

[niqaeli]

I don't read enough romance to comment on 3 directly but I suppose it's somewhat relevant that, whilst plotting a rock star AU of the MCU, I posited the Odinsons as heir(s) to a non-existent (and Ruritanian) monarchy. The royal line being unbroken, but the country itself no longer existing -- it crumbled apart in the various stresses of the first World War, the royal line ended up in exile, the country got snapped up into various other bits of Europe, etc.

It seems like the logical solution, really! Swashbuckling is perhaps a bit of a difficult sell, but royal family without a country seems ripe with opportunties for romance.

(The rockstar AU cannot be considered a romance as it contains remarkably little romance, or even sex (or drugs) for that matter. I, being a predictable parody of myself, focused rather more on the logistics of putting on a rock show than anything else. *g*)

[moon_custafer]

I haven’t fully articulated this, but I’ve seen post-WWII variants on the trope that work by (a) separating the royals from the geographic location, and (b) using it as caper-of-the-week rather than a full movie or novel. I’ll get back t this, coffee break’s over.

[sovay]

a non-existent (and Ruritanian) monarchy. The royal line being unbroken, but the country itself no longer existing -- it crumbled apart in the various stresses of the first World War, the royal line ended up in exile, the country got snapped up into various other bits of Europe, etc.

That's a great solution and I want to read it. Would you mind if I asked for a link?

Off-topic comment is off-topic

[rydra_wong]

But in the middle of the night I suddenly thought ".... has sovay seen A Girl Walks Home Alone At Night?"

So I am here to say that if not, you should; I think you would probably like it, and it has the single finest performance by a cat in a film I have ever seen.

Re: Off-topic comment is off-topic

[sovay]

So I am here to say that if not, you should; I think you would probably like it, and it has the single finest performance by a cat in a film I have ever seen.

I have not seen A Girl Walks Home Alone at Night! I have heard very good things about it, but none of them until now have included a cat. I will look for it.

(I noticed when it came out because Sheila Vand had been one of the good parts of Argo (2012), but 2014 was a difficult year.)

[swan_tower]

Not Ruritanian romance in the narrative trope sense, but I do agree that the role of "small fictitious country somewhere in Europe" is generally filled by post-Soviet states nowadays -- places like Sokovia (Avengers) or this entire list of fake -stans. Alternatively, they get stuck somewhere in Africa. And Brenda Clough's recent time-traveler trilogy involves a fictional Southeast Asian country, Jalanesia. Basically, we're still willing to accept the notion of Country We've Never Heard Of so long as it's someplace we think of as politically unstable; most Americans couldn't list every existing real-world -stan anyway, so it's easy to make room for one more that maybe just came into being or just got overrun or whatever.

But the "small monarchies into which English or American strangers could wander and be caught up in swashbuckling intrigue" part . . . these days, our Ruritanias are more likely to be tinpot dictatorships than monarchies, and the swashbuckling intrigue is more likely to be espionage or military fiction. Which says a lot about global politics, of course. But also our entire relationship with travel and tourism has changed, so that I think we don't imagine the same kinds of narratives in foreign countries as we used to.

[sovay]

Basically, we're still willing to accept the notion of Country We've Never Heard Of so long as it's someplace we think of as politically unstable; most Americans couldn't list every existing real-world -stan anyway, so it's easy to make room for one more that maybe just came into being or just got overrun or whatever.

I was thinking about those last night. To your point: I can remember finding out that Kafiristan was a real place, not just the setting of Kipling's "The Man Who Would Be King." I did not assume it was when I first encountered the story.

But also our entire relationship with travel and tourism has changed, so that I think we don't imagine the same kinds of narratives in foreign countries as we used to.

That makes me think of The Lady Vanishes (1938) as perhaps one of the last examples of old-style Ruritania and one of the first of the new: it has all the adventure of being a tourist caught up in local politics and then it has nascent Nazis. By the time similar material was revisited two years later in Night Train to Munich (1940), however defanged that film's history looks in hindsight, all its countries were real.

[watersword]

Harlequin/Mills & Boon/etc. definitely still do a version of Ruritanian romance, although they lean more to the Mediterranean and Arab states geographically, I think. The fake small monarchy (it's always a monarchy) is pretty much there to frame the kissing and the manliness, and the occasional dramatic ballgown.

[sovay]

The fake small monarchy (it's always a monarchy) is pretty much there to frame the kissing and the manliness, and the occasional dramatic ballgown.

Thank you for the data point! (I tend to think of traditional Ruritanias as monarchies almost by default, although every now and then you get a republic.)

[selkie]

I'm so glad you're only irritated!

I am back in the office. We'll see how that goes. Bronchioles are nonsense.

*hugs*
*and Ishtar*

[sovay]

I'm so glad you're only irritated!

Thank you! I'm glad you're breathing well enough to be out of the house!

I am back in the office. We'll see how that goes. Bronchioles are nonsense.

*passes the laudanum*

*hugs*

[sartorias]

I think you're right about Ruritanians. They were already an old trope by the thirties (far more popular before and around WW I)/

But Black Panther has the feel, spot on.

[sovay]

I think you're right about Ruritanians. They were already an old trope by the thirties (far more popular before and around WW I)

Agreed: the landscape had already started to change. Which means it really interests me that the best-known and most acclaimed film version of The Prisoner of Zenda is the one from 1937, when the last vestiges of the world in which that story could have been possible were vanishing right before everyone's eyes.

But Black Panther has the feel, spot on.

The more I think about it, the more it really does, while at the same time it deconstructs so many of the assumptions about nations and empire and power that with Anthony Hope came baked in. Hm. There must be scholarship on this. I wonder how on earth I would find it. [edit] Casual internet search does not turn up anything so far, but does suggest that other people made the same connection, so I can hope.

[larryhammer]

The Mouse That Roars? Though that's political satire, despite the adventure plot, rather than outright romance.

[sovay]

The Mouse That Roars? Though that's political satire, despite the adventure plot, rather than outright romance.

The pre-Code examples I've been thinking about are all satires, so I think it counts. Call Me Madam (1953) was the other late example that came to mind, being set in the tiny duchy of Lichtenburg.

[choco_frosh]

Yay steroids?

[sovay]

Yay steroids?

If they work, I'll take it!

[thisbluespirit]

I have the aftermath of two months of sinus infection and therefore get to put steroids up my nose until it gets better. We live in a wonderful world.

Er, good? I hope it works for you! <3

[sovay]

Er, good? I hope it works for you!

Thank you! (It is a little surreal.)

[a_reasonable_man]

Li'l Abner gave us "Lower Slobbovia" in 1946, ruled by Good King Nogoodnik, and in 1959, Bullwinkle and Rocky gave us "Pottsylvania," ruled by Fearless Leader, but both places are anti-Ruritarian, with no romance about them. In Slobbovia, no one has money, food, or clothes, and everyone stands around waist deep in snow with icicles hanging off their nose, while Pottsylvania, whose population seems mostly employed in espionage, is the native habitat of a Little-Shop of-Horrors-like plant, the Pottsylvania Creeper.

On the other hand, The Princess Diaries (2001) (a film I've not seen) does seem to have been an effort to revive the genre. It was a romance set in "Genovia."

[sovay]

Li'l Abner gave us "Lower Slobbovia" in 1946, ruled by Good King Nogoodnik, and in 1959, Bullwinkle and Rocky gave us "Pottsylvania," ruled by Fearless Leader, but both places are anti-Ruritarian, with no romance about them.

Still, I should not have forgotten Lower Slobbovia. It is my father's go-to reference for "ends of the earth."

(I don't think I knew about Pottsylvania or its Creeper.)

[choco_frosh]

PS: 1) I had never heard of Jinwar, the Yazidi women's commune
Well, apparently Yazidi/Kurdish/whoeverelsewantstocome, but yeah! Neither had I; that is indeed awesome; I hope that the US withdrawal doesn't mean it gets attacked or something.
Well, or it gets attacked, but then they take up arms and wind up taking over the world.

2) the landscape of Europe shifted so comprehensively that any further entries would have to be period pieces
The one late-twentieth-century example of the genre that I can think of fits that: one of Lloyd Alexander's Vesper Holly books that was set in the Grand Duchy of Unwahrschein, Somewhere-in-preBismarck-Germany.
...actually, on reflection, ALL of the VH's are sorta Ruritanian, but that's the one that's the most smack-dab on the genre.

[sovay]

Neither had I; that is indeed awesome; I hope that the US withdrawal doesn't mean it gets attacked or something.

Yes. Or their neighbors defend them along with themselves. Either way, that they last.

The one late-twentieth-century example of the genre that I can think of fits that: one of Lloyd Alexander's Vesper Holly books that was set in the Grand Duchy of Unwahrschein, Somewhere-in-preBismarck-Germany.

I forgot about that entire series! You are totally right that except for the one where they stay in Philadelphia, they're all Ruritanian historicals. Thank you.

[brigdh]

Thank you for the link to the Mesopotamian article! It was fascinating. I was particularly amazed by this bit:
To escape this, a “substitute king ritual” had to be performed. For this, the actual king stepped down for up to 100 days, and during this time he pretended to be and was addressed as a farmer, while a “substitute king” — often someone from the margins of society — formally became king in his stead.
Sadly, for the substitute king, the only way to absorb the effects of the evil omen was for him to be sacrificed. The real king was then free to resume his royal duties.

I've known of the Greek pharmakós tradition, but I had no idea there was a similar practice in Mesopotamia!

I also agree with your suggestion that Black Panther is an African Ruritanina, which is a neat new way of looking at the movie.

[sovay]

I've known of the Greek pharmakós tradition, but I had no idea there was a similar practice in Mesopotamia!

I'm glad I linked it! One of the things I really wanted to do in grad school was study Greek/Near Eastern mythological/folkloric overlap, similarities and differences. Typologies are simplistic, but shared traditions are neat.

I also agree with your suggestion that Black Panther is an African Ruritanina, which is a neat new way of looking at the movie.

Thank you!